[bradical]

hi folks,

well, i ve been having an odd problem when starting the new 45 since i got the car. it happens intermittently and has the folloiwng symptoms:

(1) turn key and the starter cranks away like mad and the engine is spinning but it doesnt catch. successive tries will get it going but i have to pump the gas or it will take 4 or 5 tires to get it to start

(2) once it starts, the **** thing seems to run perfect, no missing, stuttering, anything...fast as **** and smooth as silk.

(3) it does NOT happen after short moves of the car

(4) it DOES happen after ive driven the car a bunch of medium trips ,stopping and starting inbetween each trip., and then let it sit for a couple of hours and then try to start.

(5) it does not happen all the time in the above situation. its like a 50/50 chance it will occur....and temperature does not seem to be a factor.

(6) always on a flat grade and my oil is at the perfect level (i.e.. low on the "normal" zone.)

ive taken it to the dealer twice to see if they can reproduce and they cannot do it (prolly because they are not actually driving it for a while before the test). they have run full diagnostics on the computer and sensors and have no errors or stall codes (even tho it has started and stalled a few times before the no start occurs).

i am currently trying to get my camcorder set up and ready so when i think its going to happen, i can record it. i can smell gas in the exhaust when it spins like crazy like its pumping in fuel, but not sparking.

anyone have any ideas? or better yet, where i can start with the dealer to force them to start replaceing things :lol:

thanks!

 

[carsunltd32]

this has actually happend to me in my 35 about 2 times since Ive gotten it...first time it happend when the car was about 2 months old...2nd time was jus random and usually happens under those conditions that bradical stated.
would love to hear what this could be because its hapend in the 35 and 45

 

[bradical]

this is good to know that this issue may not be specific to a given engine (vq vs. vk)...

 

[bradical]

ok...i caught it on tape today. first try too. sometimes its even worse than what you are going to hear here. in this clip i try to start the car.... starter is flying away and the engine starts to catch but immediately dies.....then i try again and let it fly and it finally catches. i am NOT touching the gas at all while doing this.

 

[carsunltd32]

wow when you first started it the starter realli worked...though it was a while ago I dont think mine was like that but something like it...lucky you got it in tape.

 

[bradical]

yeah...the starter flys away like mad, and it definately catches the engine and gets its spinning.....the only problem is that the engine itself doesnt catch (i.e.. like no spark or something). even if the engine does catch, it usually fires a couple cylinders and then stalls which makes it even harder to start.

 

[carsunltd32]

maybe you should go to the dealer and tell themto do an extended service on it...like keep it for a few days and see if it happens to them if it does maybe theyll have a good idea of what your talking about.

 

[bradical]

ive had it over there twice, but only for a day. they could not reproduce it. the reason why is becuase you need to drive it for a bit and then let it sit for about an hour or two.

im going to bring it in with my videotape and leave it with them for a while and tell them that they need to start replaceing stuff to trial and error get it fixed since all of the diagnostics are not pointing to any of the components being bad.

it sucks because once the car starts, it runs great and is fast as all **** :twisted:

 

[kcrudup]

Humor me- change the battery in your iKey. Just a guess: perhaps the anti-theft isn't (dis)engaging (which will let the engine crank but not start) 'cause the 3rd time you've hit the iKey battery (door open, key turn, engine verification) in that short amount of time there's not enough juice for a clean challenge/response signal back?

 

[bradical]

you may be correc there as the sales guy who sold me that car suggested that in the beginning , but i dont think the techs responsed to it.

i am calling in tomorrow to bring the car in and im brining my video and your advice. its wild, becuase this engine just purrrs when once it starts.

im hoping its something like the battery that can be fixed without any real evasive action on the engine itself.

the good thing is that i reproduced it and got it on film

it hard to look cool when im leaving the gym and this baby is sputtering and spitting white smoke in the face of all the hot chicks leaving :lol:

 

[Dakine]

Am surprised simple ecu diagnostics has not found this problem.
The logging system on most cars now is pretty sophisticated.
Anyway, think the intelli key idea is a good/valid one. Certainly seems to be electrical. If not connected to the intelli key then an ecu glich. I have personally dealt with problems on VW's, BMW's and Ducati bikes to name a few, with similar problems. All turned out to be an electrical problem tied into the ecu unit (brain). What bothers me is that a good tech. should be able to diagnose this pretty quickly for you.
Good luck and let us know how it goes.

Nick

 

[bradical]

supposedly they ran daignostics on the car and all info was normal and no stall codes or anything. this seems bogus to me as the car usually kicks over and then stalls....then it takes a while start again.

 

[Dakine]

Well good luck with it and don't let em bs ya.
Few problems I have encountered have been from fitted alarm systems.
Anyway, they should be able to diagnostic check it. If they are NOT engaging the brain then maybe prompt them with, intelli key or ecu or alarm.

Folks need a lil "taser" jolt sometimes

 

[Dakine]

OOPS,
just seen you have an "aftermarket" org. decal/sticker. That may be your problem and void the factory warranty ROFLMAO :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


OMG, some dealers LOL

 

[revOevoM]

If it's thought that the I-key's low bat could be the issue, wouldn't a simple test be to leave the I-key out of range and use the metal key? If no problems, it should support the battery issue. No?

 

[bradical]

ya know.....this is intersting....ive NEVER taken out the starter plug and used my key in over a year and a half of having a tech package.

crappy weather today, but when it ends im going to try this.

 

[bradical]

ok...i started the car with the key only and the same issue , so im pretty sure its not the fob itself communicating with the ECU.

funny thing....after i spend 5 minutes trying to figure out how to remove the plug, i realized that you dont/cant. there is a little trap door in the top of the plug that swings open and you push the key right thru the top of the starter knob/plug

 

[revOevoM]

oh, yes. I tried that as soon as my SA asked if the car would start w/o the I-fob. They ought to force service to read at least the owner's manual for cars they support. And this was a year and a half after the I-key had been available... :roll:

So, are you now back to square one with your startup problem :?:

 

[bradical]

yup.

taking it in tomorrow. have appt scheduled and ill bring in my camcorder.

something is definately not right, but it sure isnt the keyfob.

 

[jwm]

Sure sounds like you have a small leak in your fuel line, allowing the system to depres, and then requiring the pump to develop adequate head pressure to support ignition. Fuel injection systems need a tight pressurized system in order to facilitate quick starts. I would ask the dealer to conduct a pressure-drop test to ensure system integrity. I had a very similiar problem with my 02 Benz; it turned out to be a small fitting leak.